There have been a number of photos posted all over the web of individuals who played a role in the riots following the Vancouver Canucks’ Game 7 loss to the Boston Bruins in the Stanley Cup Final on June 15, 2011. These photos are all over Facebook but also on a number of different web sites and blogs that focus on these riots. The pictures seem to be of young people (I will use this term throughout this post however I realize some of these folks may be adult and not technically “young people” under the Youth Criminal Justice Act) who headed downtown to watch the game and participate in the festivities that ended up making some incredibly poor choices that evening. To me, it does not appear that these young people were part of the “black bloc” anarchist group that seemed to start the riot, but were part of the group of purportedly ordinary young citizens that wreaked havoc over the city’s downtown core in the hours following. Many of these pictures include names of those in the photos as well as some very detailed biographical information. All of this information will live on in infamy on the web.
Over the past several hours I’ve been having some interesting discussions in response to one of these photos posted on Facebook by a friend of mine from Vancouver (a wonderful gentleman who was instrumental in making me feel so welcome during the Olympics). The focus of the discussion was what should happen to some of these young people. There seem to be some varied opinions, as is evident by exploring the different sites throughout the web.
The main concern I am having is that there appears to be somewhat of a mob mentality against these young people. Assuming they are found to have played an actual destructive role in the riot I am in no way suggesting there should not be serious consequences. Public villification may not be the appropriate response though. These young people, many of which would have the fact of any charge protected from publication under the Youth Criminal Justice Act, are now largely revered throughout Vancouver. They are all over the Internet. Any potential employer or an admissions committee for a post-secondary program who searches them on Google or another search engine will find tons of negative information about them. In the whole scheme of things, I question whether there transgressions is worthy of such publicity while many of those charged with much more serious criminal acts, or even those who behave questionably and unethically but do not break any criminal laws, will go largely unnoticed. On the other hand, an argument could be made that being publically shamed in such a manner, assuming the public has its story straight (which they very well might not), is an effective means of justice.
I can appreciate that the fine people of Vancouver are embarrassed about what happened to their city, so I don’t necessarily blame them for their anger. There are definitely wounds here that go beyond public embarrassment: there were injuries, and businesses suffered property damage and, perhaps more notably, may suffer in the ensuing years as some tourists may decide to stay away from Vancouver (Toronto did easily recover from the G20, although, as I will explain in a future blog post, that was a very different event from the Vancouver riots).
The question I have is how should the justice system deal with these particular young people – the local citizens who decided to join the mob. I would suspect a number of factors led them to do this. Alcohol and mob mentality are at the top of the list. Each individual may also have their own story to tell. They could come from broken homes, have social issues, addiction problems, etc. Participating in this riot may have nothing to do with such issues, or they could be the root cause that led to the decision. On the other hand, some of these young people may just be “spoiled brats” that do not care, and never did care, about the city and should be treated with a similar brush when suffering criminal penalties (the folks who came home and boasted about how “cool” the riot was on Facebook may very well fit into this category, but we can’t say for sure). My personal feeling is that the justice system should consider whether there were any root causes and see if a consequence can be constructed that is appropriately harsh, serves to deter others, but also helps some of these young people as they seek to move on with their lives. The reality is that any charges laid against these particular young people would not be overly serious. I could see arrests for things like mischief and destruction of property. The fact that these offences occurred during a serious riot would definitely be aggravating.
My opinion on the most appropriate legal consequence is some sort of intense diversion program. This resolution would hold the young people sufficiently accountable but also recognize that they may be good people who somehow got themselves caught up in a mob mentality. I’m not suggesting an easy program but rather many hours of community service, speeches to community groups, intense counseling for any underlying issues, etc. Once a program like this is sufficiently completed the criminal charges could be withdrawn. I would expect the program itself to be more harsh than any potential sentence and probation order, but it would provide an opportunity for the young people to move on with their lives. I note that such an alternative I see as being appropriate for those involved in the acts of vandalism who were not part of the group that started the riot. Any incidences of assault or violence against individuals may not be appropriate for such a program.
Others I spoke with will likely disagree with my suggestion above. Many in Vancouver will feel that these young people need to be made examples of and that punishments should be extremely severe. It would not surprise me if a large number of citizens call for some serious jail time. My main concern is the long-term consequences. I feel very strongly that, even if dealt with extremely harshly today, there should be efforts made to avoid saddling people with a criminal record when their are alternatives to doing so. I feel this way about many criminal charges I see in the courts but see this incident as a good example of how the criminal justice system has the potential to do good things for the individual charged while also ensuring that communities do not suffer further harm and others are sufficiently deterred from behaving in a similar fashion.
Please share your thoughts on how to appropriately deal with these young people in the comments section. All viewpoints appropriately expressed will, of course, be respected. I’m also interested in the thoughts of anyone who may have played a role in the riot and how they might be viewing their behaviour a couple days later. Given that some of these young people may be minors, in deference to the Youth Criminal Justice Act I will not approve any comments that provide any identifying information. I realize major media sources have been posting names, but I will not be doing so.
This blog post was written by Toronto Criminal Lawyer Adam Goodman. For more information on Adam’s practice, please see his web site at www.aglaw.ca or contact him at 416-477-6793.
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i have mixed feelings about the so called named and photoed culprits and how best to bring them to “justice” ..
good points made… good read ..thanks..
Why are you making excuses “mob mentality” or “broken home” etc for someone doing something that is clearly wrong? There were lots of people there that didn’t do any damage or act like idiots. Are you saying they all have perfect lives your sadly deluded. But then again your a lawyer looking at ways to protect the so called innocent till proven guilty crowd.
Kent, your comment would carry a lot more credibility if you left out the last sentence. With respect, I find it very ignorant and shows a lack of understanding of the role of a criminal lawyer, not to mention that lawyers may have opinions that may seem inconsistent with their professional role. For example, there may be criminal lawyers who feel sentencing laws are too light.
Having dealt with people charged with criminal offences I cannot think of one person who was not a good person deep down. That does not mean they should escape punishment, but there are often root causes that lead people to behave in a certain manner.
For the purpose of deterring further transgressions of the law, these shaming websites will have great effect no doubt.
But I still can’t help feeling that there is something obscene about them for two reasons.
First, these websites seem to be doing the job that rightfully belongs to the courts, judges, and juries. They are passing judgements on people that will alter their lives forever. What’s worse they are doing it without any regard to standards of evidence, due process, or fair sentencing. (yes, the pictures are compelling . . . so send them to the police and let them deal with it).
Second, it seems these websites are are just the other side of the same coin: As I view the pictures and read the commments, I hear the mob yelling behind me, “String ‘em up!” But it was that mob mentality that is at the root of the problem in the first place.
The only positive thing that has come out of this for me is that it has given me a chance to discuss peer pressure and making choices with my children (grade 2 and grade 5). I showed them them some of the videos and explained what was happening and then we dicussed why young people with so much potential would throw it all away by engaging in a senseless act of destruction. We talked about what they could do and should do when a group of friends were inciting them to do something they knew to be wrong and why it might be difficult to make the right choice in those situations. Hopefully, armed with this knowledge and having had the lesson impressed upon them by images of the riot, they will make the right choice the next time a mob is inciting them to action.
I agree that the role of passing judgment should be left to courts and that these web sites may be going too far. On the other hand, we saw in Toronto that public outrage and social media can be more effective than law enforcement. I’m referring to two G20 police being charged criminally many months after the event after law enforcement had closed the file.
My main concern is that the “mob” may pass judgment on a photo without its full context. For example, a person seen with a purse from The Bay may have taken it from a looter and had the intention of returning it.
I find it nonsensical that individuals who are proudly doing violent things in a public place — in front of thousands of people, in front of hundreds of cameras — should expect these actions to remain private.
They wanted lots of attention, they got lots of attention. How are they going to learn that their actions have consequences if we coddle them? Vancouverites, and the rest of Canadians too, are doing a lot of soul-searching. I hope the perpetrators are too.
You know, as much as I want to think that there are alternative solutions to this, such as you have suggested, have their merits, we do not have the resources to do so. I think that some people in the crowd made a stupid mistake that they will regret, and I do hope that they are able to rise above that and move on with their lives. They can do this by turning it around and beginning to lead by example. When one forgives themselves and vows to move on, I believe they will overcome.
With that said, I am bothered that you so easily make excuses for these people, hinting that there are “root causes” that these people can hang their blame. It really disgusts me when people look to place the blame on other things. It washes away accountability and a sense of humility. People are losing these two things. They are bragging about their involvement like a badge of honor. They are posing and cheering in front of cameras with a smile. Others seeing those images and showing their disgust hopefully sends the message that at that moment, they made a choice. That moment was not full of excuses of crappy parents or unhappy childhoods, or as a lame protest message, it is just about their choice. Maybe we need more moments that shine a spotlight on humility.
And it is amazing how through all of this, we are still trying to deny the age of technology and the creation of a digital footprint and how technology allows the public to be its own reporter. This is our reality. We have bought into places such as facebook, where we freely give our information in innocence and comfort. We project our thoughts without thought that it is out there for the world to see. It is only when that footprint becomes marred with negativity that we realize its power and we begin to realize that like life, that maybe we need to think before we type or act out. Right now, we are being schooled of its power and how our choices steer impressions. Maybe instead of villifying this media and trying to provide excuses of how it will ruin lives, that maybe just maybe, you could have expressed that if the individual takes charge of their actions there is the ability to rebuild a reputation.
You’re article is full of passing blame, not highlighting how to take hold of personal accountability in this day and age. For shame.
Did you even read my article? I gave a very clear and concrete suggestion on how to hold these people perfectly accountable. This would be far more effective than any consequence a sentencing court would be able to give under the Criminal Code and Youth Criminal Justice Act.
Yes, I read this article. Others read your article. You perhaps do not agree with our responses.
Welcome to the age of social media and the age of the internet. You ask for suggestions to deal with them on legal avenues all you wish, but now, the bigger questions of this time in technology should be “How do these people atone transgressions and restore reputations on on the internet?”.
While I may not agree with your view on social websites and the mob mentality that is being displayed on them, I would argue that you do had a valid opinion that needs to be explored as we move ahead. We may find that some of these young people are unjustly vilified for what in the end will turn out to be minor transgressions. However, there is a large difference between having a stolen purse in your possession – or even, for that matter, being caught up in the moment and stepping in to the store and taking something – and lighting a fire, attacking someone in a group, or threatening a woman with a skateboard.
The people that are being called out on Facebook and other sites are may well be the victims of a mob mentality that is very similar to what they were caught up in during the riots, and, some might argue, anonymously from behind computer keyboards, but, “Live by the sword, die by the sword.” if you wanted the attention of the world when you were drunk and caught up in the emotion of the group, you will still have to live with yourself the next day when the hangover kicks in. In this day of cell phones with cameras and instant updates on Facebook, there isn’t a person among us who should be surprised at the negative attention that is coming down so harshly on these people. And that includes them.
I was sickened and very upset by what I saw on Wednesday. And as each subsequent day has passed, I have found myself both very angry with the horrible display by some of our youth and saddened by the way some of the lessor transgressors have been painted with their own scarlet letters. The stain on their character will take a long time to go away, but it will, and it will only go away if they own up to their mistakes, take their lumps, and turn themselves into good solid citizens. This will not happen overnight, and in this day of instant gratification, will seem unfair to some. But such is life. What you did to our beautiful city was unfair to us.
It will take a long time for the stain on Vancouver to disappear. But time and effort heals all. And maybe, just maybe, the stain on your reputations will be expunged through hard work on your part over this same time period. If you are young and made a mistake, suck it up and take your medicine. If you went further than youthful indiscretion would allow for, you’ve bitten off more than you can chew, and you deserve the public calling out that you are getting – just be thankful that this isn’t a few centuries ago – you be in stocks where we would all be able to spit on you the way you spit on us. And if
you weren’t there and are angry, you have every right to be and shaming the rioters is your right. But do so carefully and
not as part of the mob. Don’t let you anger bring you down to their level. It will only make this worse.
What about the fact that, in comparison to other crimes, those committed on Wednesday night are not overly serious. It was really just property damage. It just happens that people are offended by what happened so there is a great deal of attention being placed on the perpetrators. On Saturday I watched Global BC for some riot coverage, yet after they were done speaking about the riot there was coverage of some horrible crimes which few will pay attention to.
“… those committed on Wednesday night are not overly serious. It was really just property damage.” Yes and no. Any participation in the riot itself makes those crimes far more seious in my mind because it reduces the police and firefighters’ ability to deal with the crisis, which could have potentially caused loss of life. By lighting a garabge can on fire during the riot you may have prevented a firefighter from responding timely to a more serious fire that threatened hundreds.
It was fortunate that nobody was killed.
I am not for light sentencing of rioters and looters, but having said that, I am more strongly opposed to the shaming media sites than ever. I have already seen one very prominent shaming site label someone as a looter and then retract that statement. The act of labeling somebody a looter online when they were not is criminal in my mind.
Here is what should happen: The Vancouver Police Department should gather photos and have their own photo ID site with the term: ‘person of interest.’ This term can include calls for witnesses or suspected participants. Remember the term innocent until proven guilty?
Yup, when are people going to be taught by parents or basically learn that there are consequences for one’s actions. Who do these idiots things pays for all this damage. I think the parents of these 20 somethings should sell their homes and pay for the damage their spawn have caused. After all that these are the morals and ethics the parents have instilled in their children. Total disregard and respect for other peoples property. Same thing goes for young people who light schools on fire…make the parents pay and then MAYBE these parents will spend some time bringing up decent citizens. Something is lacking and must be dealt with. Sure happy it wasn’t my care that was burned and trashed. Seems these idiots have no ability to put them selves in some else’s shoes
Looks like a clear case of unbalanced brains here. Checkout the Youtube video on Brain State Technology and look for the videos on how this modality has helped stop violent behaviour tremendously with inmates. Normal balanced brains do not behave like we have witnessed. Don’t care what caused this just want a solution and I would bet that if these perpertrators had brain scans done…all would show significant imbalances. This modality also work amazing for sleep and anger issues. Lots of information on Brain State Technolgy ..just google it
What concrete evidence is there that anarchists started this riot? Anarchists generally do not like organized sports, nationalism, aimless violence, or the horrible destruction of trees (as I saw on one video). Anarchists try to save trees, not destroy them. I do not consider myself an anarchist. I do know that they have destroyed property in demonstrations, and I oppose that. I am simply asking what evidence is there that this particular riot was an anarchist riot other than a mask? What I saw was sheer hatred and violence of an a-political nature. It was a sporting event that glorified one side, coupled with materialism and product fetishism. It did not appear to be anarchist in any way. I say this as someone who does not consider himself an anarchist, and may even oppose certain key elements of their political stance.
Who is without guilt first throw a stone. I can’t defend all the people in a crowd but it’s obvious, just as you stated in your article, that not everybody was part of the anarchy group which started the riot. There is far more reasons behind everybody who attended it, we can’t just blame crowd psychology.
But what I see as the biggest problem is that “public shaming” of looters on social networks or blogs. Nobody can say from one or two pictures if the person in the photo is guilty but some people (e. g. Captain Vancouver) are trying to take justice to their own hands. This is what we need to fight.
At the end, justice will choose some scapegoats from the crowd ([Name removed] is great example) and they will make them an warning example. The rest of them will never be accused of anything, in the worst case they will have to do public services.